Roeder on Souness: Character Assassination By Default?
March 2nd, 2006 by Jack PickardRight, well first of all I’m one of the Newcastle fans who noticed State Of The Game through the erm… shall we call it “well-discussed” topic of the relative size of Newcastle United. I’m not going to dwell on this, however. Nor am I going to dwell on who I want as our next manager, or why, or whether they’ll come, where we’ll finish and so on. This sort of thing has been discussed in great detail elsewhere. What I want to talk about is one particular thing: the character assassination job Glenn Roeder is carrying out on Graeme Souness - I think without even being aware of it.
Firstly, it’s clear that under Souness morale both on the pitch and in the stands was low. It was clear that we were playing poorly and getting poor results. It was also clear that we had a small squad with a lot of injuries which may not have been Souness’ fault.
So what’s happened? Roeder was appointed as caretaker manager, and said that he wasn’t expecting to change much, and he felt sorry for Souness - although that’s how it was in football. Yet over the following month he appears to have managed to demolish what little remained of Souness’ managerial reputation.
In brief, then:
Last four league games under Souness (Middlesbrough, Fulham, Blackburn, Man City): 1 draw, 3 defeats. Goals for 2. Goals against 7. Players missing over this time: Owen, Carr, Taylor, Parker, Dyer, Emre (missed 3 of 4).
First four league games under Roeder (Portsmouth, Aston Villa, Charlton, Everton) : 3 wins, 1 draw. Goals for 7. Goals against 1. Oh, and much improved performances (although still not perfect); morale on and off pitch also much improved. Players missing over this time: Owen, Carr, Taylor, Dyer (missed 2), Shearer (missed 2), Babayaro (missed 2), Bramble (missed 1).
So that’s approximately the same quality of opposition, approximately the same problem with injuries/suspensions and quite a different return in terms of points…
But let’s look at the different management techniques revealed in interviews to find out exactly how Roeder is plunging that knife further into Souness’ back.
Firstly, training. Now, maybe this is because Roeder has special skills, being a former defender, but when talking about the defence, he said he “was surprised the first few times I worked with them because there was no communication” and “I don’t know how you can play as a defender without giving information and covering each other. It’s that simple. We have got them working together and talking to each other.”. As the local Evening Chronicle (www.icnewcastle.co.uk) points out, while Roeder has not directly criticised Souness, the implications of this are fairly clear.
Now, we’ll move onto the alliterative man-management and maintenance of morale. Souness bemoaned his luck with injuries, stating that “The reason we’re not winning games is because we haven’t got our best players on the football pitch.”. Which seems to me to be a somewhat negative approach, and also suggests that he’s telling the players he is sending out that their own manager doesn’t think they are up to it, and they’ll be out of the side as soon as he can drop them.
Roeder preferred to have a more positive attitude “I’ve been a bit fed up with the negativity leading up to this game (Everton) .Apparently, because we haven’t got Alan playing, we haven’t got Michael playing and we haven’t got Kieron playing, the best we could hope for was probably a 0-0 draw. I told the players before the game that was absolute rubbish. I said I didn’t think they’d been shown the respect they deserved.”. Which to me tells the players that he’s got confidence in them, that he believes in them, and - well I’m no psychologist, but I would think it might help morale.
And if that indirect comparison isn’t enough in itself, he goes on to give that knife another little twist : “Don’t forget I spent two years out of the game and I sat and watched and heard managers making excuses before a ball was kicked in some games. What kind of message does that send out to the players?”
Because of the way he’s bent over backwards to avoid mentioning Souness at times, it seems he’s not actually trying to carry out a hatchet-job on what remains of Souness’ managerial reputation… but he appears to be managing it nonetheless.
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March 2nd, 2006 at 9:07 pm
The last quote used is the only one which actually nods towards Souness, the rest are merely indirect comments on the negative conditions Souness left with the club. It is true that the fans and players dropped their heads before the Everton match, which like Roeder said, shouldn’t happen. The players shouldn’t have been worrying about who was missing and instead should’ve focus on beating a side who were worse on paper, this belief showed especially in the second half.
At least Roeder seems determined to be positive and appears to cherish his time as manager, as he exhumes a genuine respect for the fans and club that I never felt was present under Souness. As for him, he tried to get us playing narrow Liverpool-esque football, his selection was appalling and he was generally arrogant, inflammatory and miserable. Good player, shit manager. Who cares if his reputation’s in tatters, I could never have envisaged singing his name from the stands so we’re better off without him.
March 2nd, 2006 at 9:15 pm
Who cares?
March 2nd, 2006 at 9:34 pm
I was quite shocked when Souness was originally appointed because (banter aside this week) I thought the Newcastle job would have had more pulling power than someone who has failed with more clubs than he’s had success with, especially in England. His demise after such a short time came as no real surprise though and I think the board caught themselves on quite quickly that the knee jerk reaction appointment of a self-styled “disciplinarian” after the problems Sir Bobby had in controlling some of the rabble didn’t quite work out.
As sometimes happens with a caretaker manager, the side gets a temporary boost in enthusiasm (’the wicked witch is dead’ syndrome) but I still don’t think Roeder is up to the job fulltime. He seems like a nice enough guy who is full of enthusiasm but, as he found at West Ham, that often isn’t enough at the top level.
March 2nd, 2006 at 11:00 pm
“Glenn Roeder’s Black ‘n’ White Army” would be a really good chant, but so would “Osmar Hitzfeld’s Black ‘n’ White Army”.
Personally, I do not believe that Newcastle will win anything until:
1) The Blue Star logo again appears on the team shirt
2) The Beastie Boys’ “Fight for the Right” is played before every home game
March 3rd, 2006 at 7:29 am
Roeder has already ruled himself out of the job anyway, however, whilst he has the guys on the pitch doing the business he at least stops fat fred from making another panic appointment so at least we wont end up with another souness (I hope I’m right in saying this anyway). I live in fear of seeing Steve Bruce / Martin O’Neil or some other similar muppet appointed for this job, I only hope the board take their time over this one and get a man in who can take us up that level we need to get back into europe.
March 3rd, 2006 at 8:22 am
It may be Roeder is doing the assasination without realising it. But I think the reason is more global than tunnel. First we have the worst Chairman in the Premier League. You could get no worse. No self respecting Manager would work with or for the man. Bobby or Keegan have not got much good to say for him. Ken Dalglish was given over a million pounds when he was dirked to keep quiet and not write a book. Bobby was offered the same, but Bobby went ahead and published Farewell but not Goodbye. It tells us a lot about Shepherd and his one man Board.
It is also noted no mention of Shearer, yet he has been pointed out time in time out as a stirrer in the dressing room. Shepherd was scared of him and his influence, Bobby makes this clear. Shepherd wanted to sell him to the KOP for 3M, but he was scared of the backlash. He told Bobby this.
We have had a lot of trouble since we got Shearer and he will have to face the music one day. Think, the matches we have won since he took on his quasi-managers job! That then tells us something. Wha was going on in the dressing room. What was the problems we never heard. Bellamy is a classic and should never have been sold. But then Bellamy was a threat, yes a threat to the sheer selfishness of Shearer.
Shearer had one ambition, and that was to take ‘Wor Jackies’ mantle, to become the Tyneside hero. He did not understand this could never be done. There are in fact two records, one is League and the other goals scored in a Black and White shirt. Jackie Milburn has 239, plus 3 FA Cup Medals, Shearer is not even in the running. Having said this, we look at Kenny Dalglish at the KOP, player/manager. To this day still a hero. Does Shearer also covet this? He simply cannot do it.
The quiet man, suddenly tells the world and all who will listen he is going to donate his 1M pounds from his testimonial to charity. Big deal. So what is here, a knighthood for the buying. But stop and think, is he really giving any money away? He is on 100,000 p.w 5.200.000 pa. So in 10 years he has copped about 52,000,000 pounds from the Magpies, plus other monies! 1M is simply nothing to this self glorifyier. Jackie had to wait 10 years for a testimonial, and we will find according to Charlie Crowe Jackie gave a lot to the Jackie Milburn Memorial Trust Fund For disadvataged North East Children.
We will leave Jackie and come to Shearer. He really wants something more than money, because he is simply a multi-millionaire! So then at that stage he is looking for honours, most men do with that sort of money.
Glenn is small trouble compared with Shearer. If we could get rid of Shearer and the Shepherd family tomorrow, we would be League Champions next season, because it will have to happen and the Halls will have to go also. Someone is in the wings and wants the Club, but the Shepherds again are making too much money out of it. Barcaly Knapp will perhaps be that man, then and only then will we get a Real Manager and a a bloke fit to wear the No.9 shirt.
In the article its self we have seen startling figures since Souey went and this must indicate something. Was the real problem at St.James’ Park, Shearer,and the fans could not see the forest for the trees?
March 3rd, 2006 at 11:09 am
Oh dear, turns out Eddie Mckenzie is an ill informed t*****. Don’t bag on Shearer, let’s take away all his goals - I wonder where we would be then.
March 3rd, 2006 at 11:12 am
Mr Mckenzie,
Are you drunk sir?
March 3rd, 2006 at 11:16 am
My goodness, did Sir Alan used to bully you at school or something. The man is selfish (like any decent player), and single minded. He only wants success for Newcastle United and himself. Big deal.
I know, let’s get more players like paul kitson - nice guy / average player. Brilliant.
March 3rd, 2006 at 1:03 pm
Is Eddy Mckenzie from Sunderalnd??
March 4th, 2006 at 9:11 am
I noticed Roeder seemed to having a dig at Souness too.
Dyer was quoted on Souness’s motivational technique: “I can look in the mirror and know I gave my all as a player. Can you do that?”
A day or so after that was reported, we have Roeder, after the draw with Charlton: “You can’t complain. There was not one player who could go home and look in the mirror and say he did not do his best.”
I get the impression that as a fellow (sometime) but more thoughtful manager and as an ex-toon player and toon employee, Roeder was getting hacked off with Souness’ attitude towards players and building team spirit. I think it must have been difficult to stand by and watch.
Let him let off steam. I think it helps the players feel better if he articulates what was going wrong before by emphasising the opposite.
March 7th, 2006 at 11:59 am
Eddy McKenzie - please don’t subject us to any more of your utterly brainless drivel. I don’t think I’ve ever read a more spiteful and ill-informed load of garbage in my life.
You say look at how results have gone since Shearer took on his quasi-managers job and that shows how bad things must have been from him in the dressing room- he’s still in the dressing room you ignoramous! And if anything he has even more of a say now!
Your claims about his wages are complete crap - Shearer doesn’t earn 100,000 per week, never has - your figure of him earning 52,000,000 off us is laughable. I would say he’s earned perhaps a quarter of that.
Jackie Milburn has 200 goals for Newcastle. No more, no less. Goals in the wartime friendlies do not count and never have, just as the many goals Shearer has scored for us in friendly matches do not count. This has never been a matter for dispute, just an accepted fact until now we are suddenly supposed to change the rules to fit your views!
I just don’t understand where people like you come from. Why do you hate him so much? After all he’s done for us, all the goals and magic moments! No we haven’t won anything but if you honestly believe that we WOULD have won something WITHOUT Shearer then you, my friend, are living in cloud cuckoo land. Over the years Alan Shearer has done everything in his power to help us become a successful team - the fact that we haven’t and the problems we’ve had are nothing to do with him.
March 7th, 2006 at 1:43 pm
Eddy McKenzie - what a ****. End of story.
March 7th, 2006 at 2:00 pm
In response to G Sutton, I totally agree. We need a manager who wants to take us up a level, rather than see’s the Newcastle job as one which will enable him to step up a level personally. Oneill has achieved nothing more than souness. Fat Sam is so long of himself its a joke. Steve Bruce is a muppett. we need an astute tactician of the highest calibre. I don’t want ranieri but he is a better candidate than any of the previosuly mentioned. Hitzveld or someone similar would appeal.
March 8th, 2006 at 1:33 pm
After the resignation of Keegan from the England manager’s post, the FA realised the time had come to forget about “Braveheart” style talisman figures and try to employ someone who actually had correct credentials for an important job. Crucially, they realised a crowd-pleasing appointment would be irresponsible. In my opinion, they got it right with Eriksson. Newcastle need to be very methodical, interview some good candidates, and use proper criteria in deciding who gets the job. I worry that we’ll appoint Martin O’Neill in the blithe assumption that success will automatically follow. His appointment would be a classic crowd-pleasing tactic. But what will it say on his CV? Wycombe, Leicester and Celtic? And what about European experience?